“Ninja” points out that the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society has indeed knowingly lied, under the direction of The Governing Body:
they have been lying….check the watchtower MAGAZINE from jan 1st 1989 ..page 12 paragraph 8 where they said….
“He was laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our 20th century.”when you check the BOUND VOLUME it has changed to
“He was laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our day.”
now if that wasn’t to hide facts or deceive it’s followers…..what is?
I have the original magazine as proof…yep a hard copy and can show it as proof….wriggle out of that watchtower
but of course it wasn’t a lie it was a terminological inexactitude….he he
I posted this to standfirm…..but he hasn’t put it up yet
First of all, isn’t it interesting that StandFirm has yet to publish “ninja’s” comment to his WTBTS apologist blog?
Helpfully, I’ll publish it here.
Ninja refers to this:
That’s the January 1 Watchtower of 1989, page 12, as published in the magazine version of the publication. However, later, when the bound volume version was printed (the bound volume is the hard bound annual compendium of the previous year’s Watchtower magazines), the above sentence was edited*.
This edit is also to be found by “honest hearted ones” when they check the Watch Tower CD Rom.
Could this be classed at open dishonesty on the part of The Governing Body, as published by the Watch Tower Society?
After all, they knew what they’d written in the loose magazine edition of the Watchtower. They knew that their prophecy had failed (yet again). They then purposefully altered what they’d said, meaning that today “honest hearted ones” who wish to ascertain whether The Governing Body does in fact accurately and truthfully speak for God have their pathway blocked by the duplicitous actions of these representatives of “the faithful and discreet slave” “class”.
- How can Jehovah’s Witnesses call their religious order, as led by The Governing Body, “the truth”, when the men whom they must obey wilfully edit history to cover over their false prophetic utterances?
- How can The Governing Body liken their leadership to that of Christ, who is “the truth”, when they frequently lead their followers into falsehoods, such as teaching that the door-t0-door syndication of Watch Tower publications will have been completed within the 20th century?
*I address this dishonesty, and others on the part of The Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses, here.
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{ 32 comments… read them below or add one }
I’m sorry but I really do not see this as lying.
I am the first one to have a go at the organisation when I can see something is very wrong, but in this case there really is no proof that they were lying.
From their point of view they felt pretty sure that the end was imminent in the 1980s.
So clearly when nothing had happened by the year 2000 they needed to change the wording, as it was not correct.
Look at it this way. If I tell my son that next weekend I will take you to the seaside, he is going to get excited about it.
Then at the last minute on Friday I realize we can’t go because I messed up. I had a previous appointment somewhere.
Was I lying to my child. No although I was guilty of messing up.
Ray Franz when he was alive wrote that generally the members of the governing body were sincere,but very misguided. I agree with him. They have got things wrong masses of times. But I do believe that they are not deliberately out to lie to the sheep.
You wouldn’t say they were purposefully concealing their error, thereby re-writing their history, so as to convince JWs that they didn’t say/mean what they actually said/implied?
Wouldn’t that just be a fancy form of lying?
This certainly is lying and here’s why:
The bound volumes and CD Rom are RECORDS of what was said by the
Society and when, they are not original documents, and the Society often use and reference them as records ‘proving’ their past actions. To alter them retrospectively is to intentionally rewrite history.
You don’t legitimately ‘update’ your information by going back and falsifying the historical record. If you want to ‘update’ your information, you offer a CORRECTION in NEW article, which then also forms part of the record so that people can accurately trace the progression of what happened and what was really said, and when.
The only reason you would avoid this is if you wanted TO HIDE what was said and make an
accurate record of your past statements impossible, so as to avoid accountability for them.
At the very least, this change to the record should have included a footnote indicating the
change and what was originally said. That they avoided doing even this clearly indicates that
their intent was deception and cover-up.
It’s not the most earth shattering of deceptions but it does show clearly their shady modus operandi and lack of integrity. And it should make every JW realize that the CD Rom and bound volumes are not always accurate reproductions of their magazines or of what the society REALLY said in times past.
Hi Izzy. Thanks for your comment. Sorry it took so long to get approved for publication.
I think that all exwitnesses would be unanimus that the society rewrite their history. Mainly by missing out the many times they have got it wrong in their 130 year history.
But really that is not lying is it? All of us are selective what we tell others about ourself. Not many of us would tell others about how stupid we were in the past.
That is what has happened with the society. They made some stupid mistakes. However there certainly is no justification for making witnesses believe something when in fact it is just another idea the society have.
There is no question that they are guilty of forcing people to believe something that is not proven, but to say they are deliberately trying to deceive, I feel is going too far. Just my view.
It’s an interesting viewpoint. Obviously I’d don’t agree; I’ve no doubt the Governing Body are purposefully deceptive.
If you’re loking for more recent evidence they consistently misquote people in the “trinity” brochure to support their position, which is the same as lying. Also more recent june 2010 awake article about the “baby mammoth”
I read the article on the “baby mammoth” I noticed that there seemed to be some important information missing, as well as some good old Watchtower selective quoting.
Bear in mind that devout Witnesses would never question the organisation or suspect that an article could be misleading them far less go and research the information to check it’s authenticity.
The article mentions the age of the animal at time of death (3 to 4 months) and the fact that it was well preservedin the ice and that it’s airways and digestive systems were clogged with silt.
Right at the end of the article they say that the “scientists were lead to believe” the animal “must have drowned”
I researched bild.com and another site with similar info.
To quickly highlight some things from the article
1.It mentions the ice age which causes Witnesses a big problem.
2. the baby mammoth has been incased in ice for 40,000 years! another big problem.
3 The actual quote” After carrying out an autopsy on the animal in St. Petersburg laboratories, they found a thick layer of sand and clay in the mouth and trunk – the four-month-old mammoth must have drowned to death in mud.”
The actual reason they have included this article in the Awake! is to help the reader along the way to believing this animal may have perished in the worldwide flood of Noah’s day.
However this belief is undermined if they include the actual facts presented in the original article. Such as how could an animal have been in ice for 40,000 years when according to JW dogma there was a worldwide flood only 4000 years ago prior to which they allege there was a sub tropical world where there could not exist large Glaciers such as the one described?
That the writers of the Awake are trying to duplicitously fool their readers into believing that this creature could have died as a result of the “Biblical flood” is not in doubt as they finish the peice by saying that scientists believe the animal ” must have drowned”. This is clearly decieving the reader into believing the death occured in water. The original source material clearly states as quoted in bold what the scientists beleived caused the animal’s death.” the four-month-old mammoth must have drowned to death in mud.”
All of this shows a basic dishonest approach to their work. The Awake is not alone in the publications of Jehovah’s Witnesses when it comes to misquoting people and scholastic dishonesty.No one asked them to put this article in their magazine , so in doing so they should be honest which they have not been. A cynical attempt to mislead the unwary.
My point is if the Governing Body allow this kind of thing and can’t even be trusted with something so mundane then what about their new world translation of the Bible and what about their doctrines and their presentation of their past history?
This is another example of them doing this : -
“…the ‘battle of the great day of God Almighty’ which will end in A.D. 1914 with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced.” (The Time is at Hand, Studies in the Scriptures, vol.2, 1886, 1911 edition, pg 101)
“…the ‘battle of the great day of God Almight’ which will end in A.D. 1915 with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced.” (The Time is at Hand, Studies in the Scriptures, vol 2, 1886, 1915 edition, pg 101)
When this prediction for 1914 failed, the WT org. ‘updated’ their edition of the Time is at Hand book by changing the date, 1914 to 1915. Changes like this are made quietly, and are slipped in with any announcement. Why is that? This is a blatant and deliberate change. They have said one thing and then changed it to another in the hope that their members wont notice. It is indeed deceptive, dishonest and wrong!
somebody at bethel has had to look at that watchtower…..then say to themselves….oops…..we said it would be here before the end of the 20th century…(and we are God’s organisation on earth) …so it don’t look too good for us
then they’ve doctored the books…plain and simple….so when witnesses look at the bound volume….nothing is amiss…it says “in our day”
we are not talking about a father letting his child down gently here….we are talking of a group of leaders obviously happy to keep their power status quo..by hook or by crook…..or they are out on their arses looking for work and homes
I typed in “doctored the books” into google….and every time whether it was aircraft mechanics or accountants or van drivers who were doing the doctoring …there was a crime involved……and the watchtower is guilty of the crime of deception…..on itself first and it’s adherents
alan you also said
they are guilty of forcing people to believe…..”forcing”?…that tells me everything about their M.O
so wouldn’t it be just as likely they are forcing control on their followers by hiding the original “truth”?
they are a group of deceivers….
and ray franz found out when they hounded him out of bethel in double quick time that the sheeplike organisation had awfully big teeth for a wooly mammal
we found it out too….so don’t give me they wouldn’t deceive…cause I or others aint swallowing it
cheers
It’s worth restating this point;
StandFirm is looking for evidence of when the Watch Tower Society published information it knew was false.
As has been pointed out here, this is a straw man; how can anyone outside the realms of power at the Watch Tower Society know whether what is published is knowingly false…
This suggests, to me at least, that StandFirm, like many half-assed Governing Body apologists, don’t really want to know or see the truth about the men they worship. That’s why his blog posts, and his responses, are so full of logical fallacies.
Much like the pages of the Watchtower, know that I think about it…
Here is a clear Lie that I sent to Stand Firm.
Watchtower July 1, 1943 p.204-206
Claiming direct quotes-revelation from the Lord!
If true, why was this new revelation not part of the NWT cannon? If it did not happen, it was a LIE. If it did happen then how can the current GB overturn it, if they are fallible & uninspired? The Lord’s word is timeless.
The following is a summary of the article. There is only one organization claiming to fill the righteous requirements of Jehovah. That organization which is represented by the Watchtower, Bible, and Tract Society is the Anointed. Jesus the King commissions the Anointed as his faithful and wise servant who, “…brings forth “meat in due season…” Then it further states that if you love the Lord, you will answer the call of the Anointed. This call is the organizational instructions. It goes on to give the chain of authority as Jehovah speaking to us through his son, and the Anointed is the visible mouthpiece of the son. Now, the mouthpiece gives the instructions:
“The Lord breaks down our organization instructions further and makes them more practicable by further instructing us through his “faithful and wise servant.” He says, ‘Let us assign the field, the world, to special pioneers, regular pioneers and companies of Jehovah’s Witnesses…” Then there are details given on hours and back-calls for pioneers per month. The mouthpiece continues, “These directions come to us from the Lord through his established agency directing what is required of us…This expression of the Lord’s will should be the end of all controversy…These directions from the Lord…” Now, more details are given for individuals and companies dealing with territories. The Anointed then say, “…there is absolutely no excuse for anyone, man or woman, to claim to be unable to accept an individual territory assignment and assume full responsibility for it. Those who really love the Lord and are fighters for the New World will not try to excuse themselves on that or any other ground, but will hear the Word of the Lord when he says, Let us do thus and so…The Lord through his “faithful and wise servant” now states to us, “Let us cover our territory four times in six months.” That becomes our organization instructions and has the same binding force on us that his statement to the Logos had when he said, Let us make man in our image.” It is our duty to accept this additional instruction and obey it”
Notice the Anointed quoting God. This is a ‘thus says the Lord.’ The question is, did the Lord say this? You will look in vain in the Old and New Testaments to find these organizational instructions. So this is a new word of the Lord from the Anointed. Here is an important scripture to keep in mind while reading this Watchtower article:
Jeremiah 23:31-32
If not a lie then the GB is guilty of either (1) taking away from the Lord’s word via their changing the standards without a further direct command & (2) disobedience in not still teaching this command from the Lord.
Standfirm’s standard is below. How would the above example not qualify?
Look at the definition of the word “lie”:
“To make an untrue statement with intent to deceive”-Emphasis added.
Has StandFirm gone into hiding? It would seem he has received several more submissions to his illogical quest than the 3 or 4 he’s allowed to be published on his blog!
I refer again to my earlier pejorative of “coward”…
Great response from everybody, and certainly most of what has been said is totally true.
There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the society do deceive people, keep things quiet, and only print what actually helps their cause.
However in the ONE instance that we were talking about here, I still do not see it as lying. They simply updated their information.
I will give another example.
A government says to the nation, we will have inflation under control before the end of the 20th century.
Then, come the end of the 20th century, inflation is still not under control. So they put out a new statement, that inflation will definately be under control in two years time.
Did they blatently lie?
No they did not. Their aim and expectation was that it would be sorted by the end of the century. That did not happen, so they then make a new date. That is exactly what the society did.
So remember guys, I am only talking about this one case. For 130 years the society have certainly covered up things and been selective with what they tell the sheep. But I believe if we were to use this one particular example of them covering their backsides, then we would be giving them reason to call us being petty.
Again, I hear what you’re saying, and you do make a lot of sense. Opposers often uses examples like this (ie. our objection) to call us petty.
But it’s easy to forget that the institution we’re referring to claims to be “the truth” and God’s official spokesgroup on earth.
Therefore, they need to be held to a higher standard of truth, honesty and transparency than anyone else, even governments.
That is so true Mark. One of the things JWs often say, is that the churches do things wrong as well.
They do seem to forget that their organisation is meant to be the truth and the channel that God is useing. So in this example we are talking about, and the many other times when they have changed their history, it really shows that they are no different to the ones that they condemn.
Which is the realisation the Witnesses could really do with coming to. It may help prevent more needless blood transfusion related deaths, it may allow kids to plan some sort of future, it may relieve the perpetual pressure to perform monotonous religious works.
Then the Witnesses could choose to find the truth for themselves.
another wee question
when was the 1989 watchtower bound volume first out?….was it before or after the end of the 20th century?
if before….they weren’t merely updating their information…as the end of the 20th century wasn’t upon them….
Mark,
My earlier post was poorly written and confusing, I have rewritten the same info and am re-posting to Standfirm & here regarding the Watchtower article “Righteous Requirements” July 1, 1943
In the article the “Slave” quotes direct revelation from the Lord four times as follows:
The Lord through his “faithful and wise servant” now states to us, “Let us cover our territory four times in six months.”
“The Lord breaks down our organization instructions further and makes them more practicable by further instructing us through his “faithful and wise servant.” He says, ‘Let us assign the field, the world, to special pioneers, regular pioneers and companies of Jehovah’s Witnesses…”
And for company publishers he says “Let us make a quota of 60 hours and 12 back-calls and at least one study a week for each publisher.” That becomes our organization instructions and has the same binding force on us that his statement to the Logos had when he said “Let us make man in our image.”
Did the Lord really say this? The final quote from Gen 1:26 of course is true but what about the others which have “the same binding force”?
1. Here are four possibilities:
a. It is Yahweh through Jesus Christ through the mouthpiece (the Anointed);
b. The Anointed lied and cannot be trusted;
c. The Anointed gave a false prophecy(still a lie) and cannot be trusted;
d. The Anointed receive messages from fallen angels and cannot be trusted.
2. How much stronger can they say it?
3. If true, where is the further direct revelation to repeal the above?
4. Can the fallible & uninspired GB over rule these words spoken by the Lord?
5. Are not the Lord’s words timeless?
5. Why weren’t these revealed requirements added to the NWT canon?
Jeremiah 23:32 “ Here I am against the prophets of false dreams”… “who relate them and cause my people to wander about because of their falsehoods and because of their boasting.” “But I myself did not send them or command them. So they will by no means benefit this people’ is the utterance of Jehovah.”
Galmozzi.
To any normal human being, this would be blatent lying. But we are not dealing with normal human beings are we?
These old men in New York are totally convinced that they are the channel that God is using today.
They really think they are the representatives of God and Jesus on earth.
When you look at it that way, it is more understandable when they say these are God’s words.
You may remember this recent quote drom the society
The anointed and their other sheep companions recognize that by following the lead of the modern-day Governing Body, they are in fact following their Leader, Christ.
Sept 15th 2010 page 23
They really believe that whatever they say or do will have divine approval.
I’m sorry to mention Ray Franz again, but he did so much for us all in helping us see the light.
He did not acuse them of lying.
Half truths, double standards, misquotes, new light, only publishing the good figures not the bad.
They are guilty of all those things, and certainly any genuine mouthpiece of God would not stoop to all those things.
But to prove they deliberately lied to their members is very hard to prove.
It should be enough they are guilty of all those things I have listed.
I know I may be in the minority believing that, but we will get through to witnesses much better by showing the many, many times they have been guilty of all those things I listed.
Practically everything they have said has proved wrong over time. Therefor there is no way anyone should put their trust in an organisation that has repeatedly told the members the wrong things.
Sorry, Alan. Blatantly lying (worst case), being economical with the truth (bad case), or glossing over published errors (sleazy case), and doing so believing you’re God’s actual earthly mouthpiece (ie. the only ones among the 1.8 billion people who claim to believe in the Christo-Judean God of the Bible whom God loves and approves) is not acceptable.
John Piper, a prominent, Calvinist Christian pastor and author, believes his way of interpreting the Bible, as espoused by the theology of John Calvin, is the truth. But I’ve never heard or read him saying that unless people unquestioningly accept everything he ever says or writes as absolutely from the mouth of God, they’ll be eternally destroyed. But he still believes his interpretation of the poems, allegory, fables, documentary and letters that make up the Bible is true.
Just because he believes this, does it mean he’s right? And would his sincere belief that he best represents the teachings of Christ on earth excuse him from lying, glossing over inaccuracies, etc?
‘Course not.
The Governing Body go above and beyond even the likes of prideful Calvinists like Piper. They claim that what they say and print is actually Jehovah God Almighty himself speaking. They place their published doctrines, sayings and policies as being on the same level as the Bible; not to be questioned.
Yet, as this comment thread has shown, they do knowingly publish lies and falsehoods.
Just because they believe they’re doing it in the name of God doesn’t make it right, correct, acceptable or honest.
Franz didn’t accuse them of lying because, as you say, that’s a hard accusation to prove. And prove it he surely would have been forced to do, in court, at huge expense.
Franz carefully erred on the side of grace when he wrote his books. He believed, as you state, that the old men are totally convinced about their self-proclaimed position.
However, just because Franz, perhaps out of prudence, didn’t accuse them of lying, doesn’t mean that they’re not liars. And it doesn’t mean that they don’t know they’re liars…
sorry guys…it was only error correction…..just like winston smith putting inconvenient facts down the memory hole
Hello. What is usually the one excuse made by people who say that the bible is not inspired by God but written by men? They claim that there are errors and that words have been changed. I find it interesting that there are no changes or errors found in the word of God like the one from the Watchtower shown above. Of course I’m not talking about the exact phrase; rather, there are no errors found in scripture that are of a prophetic nature in which the wording was changed so dramatically.
The other interesting point is why make the change? Let that sink in for a minute or two. What is the motivation behind making a change like that in the wording? What pure, honest intention would be behind the change?
Hi Marie, thanks for your comments and questions. Welcome to the blog.
just posted this to stand firm
so we are now 98 years into jesus invisible reign……if and when they drop that date….will that be “error correction” too?
“error” that altered millions of individuals lives
broken families because one family member could not in good conscience accept something that didn’t sit well with them…..(see “death or obedience” website for spoken evidence of one paul barrie telling his brother matthew he and his family could no longer have any dealings with his own blood)
or will they hang on to it….like the adventists who are still clinging on to the year 1844?
the mind control is strong over them isn’t it?….posted this too
there are only two types of prophets….true and false…would you agree?
true prophets are inspired
false prophets are uninspired
so when the witnesses claimed this in 1959 (and I don’t think there has been any “error correction”…tell me if I’m wrong
On pages 40, 41 of the January 15, 1959 the Watchtower asked,“Whom has God actually used as his prophet?” Then it answers,“Jehovah’s Witnesses are deeply grateful today that the plain facts show that God has been pleased to use them.”
so were they claiming to be a true prophet or false?….
On page 136 of the “Reasoning” book it says,“We do not claim to be an inspired prophet.” They don’t deny that they claim to be a “prophet” but only that they don’t claim to be an INSPIRED prophet.
now is a true prophet inspired or uninspired?
yet the watchtower makes the claim that they are an “uninspired true prophet”
now have they claimed to be spirit directed?…yes…even in the baptism vows
(Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization)
now tell me how that works?
THEY ARE A SPIRIT-DIRECTED…NON-INSPIRED…..TRUE PROPHET
false prophets only are non-inspired…
true prophets are always inspired
except in the case of the watchtower….how can you be spirit directed and uninspired….and a true prophet?…..
hail the watchtowers third kind of prophet…unheard of before
Good post Ninja. Further to that is this quote –
“…..it must be observed that this Faithful and Discreet Slave was never inspired, never perfect.” (Watchtower 3/1/79, pg 23
In the Insight Book (1981) pg 694, the word PROPHET is described……. “….the use of this distinctive term shows that true prophets were no ordinary announcers but were spokesmen for God, ‘men of God’ with INSPIRED messages.”
In the Oct 8th, 1968 Awake, page 23, they condemn all others who make false prophecies.
“True, there have been those in times past who predicted and “end to the world”, even announcing specific dates. Some have gathered groups of people with them and fled to the hills or withdrawn into their houses waiting for the end. Yet, nothing happened. The “end” did not come. They were guilty of false prophesying. Why? What was missing? Missing was the full measure of evidence required in fulfillment of Bible prophecy. Missing from such people were God’s truths and the evidence that he was guiding and using them.”
Yet, when it comes to the Watchtower making ‘mistakes’ they make excuses that they have been over zealous and fail to accept responsibility for the fact they have indeed made false prophecies. They have even claimed it to be ‘good thing’ and beneficial for the brothers to strengthen their faith and loyalty to the organisation.
“Actually, any adjustments that have been made in understanding have furnished an opportunity for those being served by this ‘Slave’ to show loyalty and love…” (WT 3/1/79 pg 24)
They have also claimed that their false prophecies have helped JWs to get a more mature viewpoint.
“However, say that you are one who counted heavily on a date, and, commendably, set your attention more strictly on the urgency of the times and the need of the people to hear. And say you now, temporarily feel somewhat disappointed : are you really the loser? We believe you can say that you have gained and profitted by taking this conscientious course. Also, you have been enabled to get a really mature, more reasonable viewpoint.” (WT 7/15/76 pg 441)
In spite of already defining what a False Prophet is in the 1968 Awake they fail to admit that they fit the description but again excuse themselves.
“There are some who make spectacular predictions of the worlds end to grab attention and a following, but others are sincerely convinced that their proclamations are true. They are voicing expectations based on their own interpretation of some scripture text or physical event…..hence, in such cases when their words do not come true, THEY SHOULD NOT BE VIEWED AS FALSE PROPHETS……in their human infallibility, they misinterpreted matters.” (Awake 3/22/93 pg 3,4)
Isnt it true that EVERY false prophet has misinterpreted matters? If God accepted ‘human infallibility’ as an exuse for false prophecies, how would there be any False Prophets for the Bible to warn about?
They claim to be ‘spirit directed’ as you pointed out Ninja, which makes this quote in the Insight volume even more interesting. – “Being ‘the spirit of truth’, God’s holy spirit could NEVER be the source of ERROR but would protect Christ’s followers from doctrinal falsehoods.”
This is why I love the internet so much. It really is so easy now to pull these quotes up from the societies own material. Only a relatively few years ago ex witnesses would argue with witnesses using their own logic. Now we can simply go to the societies own words, to show how wrong they are, or how they are applying double standards.
No wonder the society are having to produce articles like the July 15th 2011, where they are doing their best to try to stop the sheep discussing anything spiritual with ex witnesses. It does not matter even if a person has just left the organisation (faded) you can almost hear the terror in their words and articles. I regularly post on the Topix website about JWs, and you really can see that most times the witnesses do not have a leg to stand on. They forever resort ot name calling or picking up on the smallest mistake and make it into something that somehow means everything else that is said is wrong.
The Watchtower is dying slowly, they just haven’t realized it yet.
when the bright light of real truths shine upon our false truths and expose them…….
ask yourself….do I really take on board what is being said….or go into “instant hate mode” because our precious institutions and belief systems are under attack…….this decision shows what we really feel about truth……do we think?…or react?
each of us who have left …faced that very dilemma…..and finally admitted to ourselves…”we were wrong”….then the truth set us free
the worst lying we can do is to ourselves…and that is the dilemma the governing body have….they truly are “captives of a concept”
If in reality the light that is in you is darkness, how great that darkness is!….jesus
Ninja. Do you know where I can get a copy of that Jan 1,1989 Watchtower magazine? I’d love to have a “hard copy”.